AMPRO Whips.

[Werthers]

Are these AMPRO ham sticks any good?

I can see the 20 meter versions working ok and upwards but for 40 meters and 80 meters I can't see how they would be very efficient especially on 80 meters.

They are 2.5 meters long which is about the length of a quarter wave tank whip on 10 meters.

I was thinking that two AMPRO antennas for 80 meters screwed into one of those 3/8 dipole centers would make a nice quick throw together 80 meter dipole but would probably be horribly inefficient.

Has anybody tried the AMPRO 40 or 80 antennas?

[Werthers]

I take it they are poop then?

I was just looking for a way to have a wire antenna for 80 meters rather than having to use the clumsy mag loop and getting things out every time the band opens plus having to tune it every time I change frequency. I would prefer to have something permanent so I don't have to keep digging things out the cupboards each time.

80 Meter wire antenna in a small space not possible. Not enough info on it. Not everybody has 3 miles of space to play with.

40 Meters possible

20 Meters doable

[InTheClouds]

They are clearly not very efficient for 40m and especially 80m (at 80m I reckon 100W in 15Watt radiated as a guess the antenna is mainly coil). These are 1/4 wave reduced antennas so a big part of them working ok is having a good ground to work from... i.e. a lot of metal underneath them. They are very narrow bandwidth and annoying in this regard especially the 80m one... needs constant re-tuning if you move frequency more than a few kHz either way.

The 40m does work on a car at least. The 20m one can really surprise you conditions dependent of course.... worked Japan
on 20m out of the blue using 100W, not too shabby.

They are not really good long haul DX antennas, the 20m one can dx ok but it is still not a high performance long haul DX antenna.They get lucky from time to time and unless you are sitting at the seaside a well set up wire of some sensible proportion relative to wavelength will see you 2-3 S points up.. which could be the difference between a contact or not.

In right time right place lucky situation anything will dx.. but will a compromise antenna be the one to place bets on making dx in weak conditions ? Not really.

The 20m one can be a decent compromise antenna and throw up the odd surprise through luck rather than high performance characteristics.

You can quite easily make an 80m band coil loaded vertical... at home they can be noisy if you know your QTH has a lot of QRM.. if not go for it
very simple to make. You need about 11m vertical the coil and some radials 10m x 4 is a starting point, don't expect miracle performance but likely better than AMPRO at home.

They will probably get you onto a few nets if your QRM levels are low and into Europe for 40/80m.

Never tried them in loaded dipole config, bound to be someone who did on Youtube. If you could get it very high up it would probably get you a few contacts if you are licenced to stick 100W up it.

[Werthers]

Since the workmen have been servicing the communal TV antennas a few days ago I've now got a full signal of noise right across the HF bands even on 10 meters.

I need to rethink what I'm going to do now.

I love my HF single band SSB QRP radios, it would probably be best for me to sell my 80 meter stuff or swap it for a 20 meter SSB QRP rig.

40 and 20 are my favorite HF bands. 80 meters was but its just not piratical.

30 meters
17 meters
Possibly 15 meters I'll be looking into.

I noticed they do an AMPRO for 4 meters at the same length 2.5 meters. No info on the 4 meter version tho.

[wa10]

TERRIBLE efficiency on 80mtrs but they work even miracle whips work & make contacts.

[theEarwigger]

It's the effect of the car body that sets a lot of the efficiency for these.

Don't forget the Ampro is only half an antenna. If put on a large vehicle the 80m one will be better than on a small one. But generally the 20m is pretty good. For 10m there is little differene between a horizontal wire and the Ampro.

-Rob

[InTheClouds]

For 10m static mobile I would use a 1/4 wave tank whip cut/tuned. Same price and slightly more efficient as there is no loading coil at all.

[Tim Tom]

Look up Tim G5TM on YouTube, he uses them a lot when out mobile and has cracking results by sounds of it. In one of his recent videos I think he said for things like 40 meters+ you'll need proper bonding of the mount to your car for it.

[Werthers]

The ground plane makes all the difference but even a car body wouldn't be big enough for 80 meters you'd have to add extra wires to make a bigger ground plane. It would be nice to do 80 meters from home but other than using a mag loop I can't see any other way for a home setup for 80 meters. 40 meters is a challenge but it can be done, only just.

There is an old metal barge that is sitting in a good sizable river, I could put a mag mount on that and do some portable operations and the water would make a nice ground plane.

[DX-Digger]

I soldered 4 banana Female sockets to the side of a 6" Magmount, I then solder 4 banana plug males to the end of 5Metre Tape measures
So thay can be deployed as an extra groundplane. Obviously I can use higher bands 10mtrs 6mtrs 4mtrs etc and adjust the tape lengths to suit.
The tapes were very cheap of the Bay a few years ago.
I think 10Metre tapes would be better for the lower HF bands. If I could find a few that were cheap enough!
You could even Dremmel small slots in the magmount and just press the ends of the tapes in, but I think they would need taping down if it became windy.
Tight fisted Ham mode engaged :lol
Anyway, just a few ideas

[Tim Tom]

There is an old metal barge that is sitting in a good sizable river, I could put a mag mount on that and do some portable operations and the water would make a nice ground plane.

if you do that I want video proof

[Werthers]

The barge is a decent size so that alone would make a fair ground plane with the water helping I probably wont bother I'd get some funny looks its a bit to public anyway.

I've just been experimenting with some wires on 80 meters and there are signals coming in although not very strong, something is telling me 80 meters is possible for home.

I've done the 40 meter antenna already and I'm blown away by how well its working.

[InTheClouds]

Down at the seaside where Tim often is (anywhere within 5kms of seaside is actually fine, you still get much less ground losses in the far field, between 6 - 9dB less loss meaning signals coming in and out are nicely up) so it skews what you can expect in general at home or even in the countryside for long haul DX on an ampro. You are getting close to 9dB less far field ground losses in and out down at the sea. AMPRO cannot be classified as a great DX antenna, they are very convenient, shortened loaded 1/4 wave verticals... by no means are these perfect DX antennas.

I made Japan on one but I am I saying "Great DX antenna" ? not really...they are probably technically one of the worst in fact, lossy and short, it was my only DX contact of the day other than Europe.. I got lucky right time right place and listening carefully... it was an easy contact on a very compromised antenna and no where near the sea... I just hit the very efficient opening by chance. They throw up nice surprises.

You have to remember when the conditions are ripe the worst possible antennas will still DX.

You could load 2m of wire with an ATU and still work DX in favourable conditions down at the seaside. (not far off what a ampro is !)

Youtube ham video users don't tend put videos up of the days when they went out and spoke to almost no one
on the long haul DX... so do not be entirely disappointed as you will undoubtedly have quiet days.

I only say this so you get a perspective, Youtube videos are often but not always selective and you don't tell the full story, people tend to show successes rather than failures. I also use Ampro and other larger antennas (much better ones) and on any given day you can speak to very few "DX" stations or have a good run of them. (I am not counting European short hops)

This may come across negative but at least it is a real perspective from someone else who has used these antennas. Conditions at any given moment and being at the beach are much more significant than antenna choice....but when there is weaker conditions, harder conditions to work DX, you don't want your most compromised antenna in use... that can the difference between just making a contact or being in the RX stations noise floor.

A metal chassis barge would be a superb ground plane. Fresh water is about as good as normal ground or slightly worse... you might get a bit of help from reduced ground losses if the area has a high water table as wet soil tends to be "very good soil"

At home unless you have a mass of metal under them, don't have too high expectations... you will have your fair share of quiet dx days just like everyone does. With that in mind try it and find out, that's the name of the game.

I have lost count of the days I have been out shouted myself tired for hours and had virtually no contacts... that will not be the first or last time and is not a unique experience. Real life DXing is not an edited highlights Youtube video.

[Werthers]

Thanks for all the info a great read.

An 80 meter antenna will always be drastically compromised in situations like these. I can see how inefficient these AMPRO antennas are with a resonate 1/4 wave length being approximately 80 feet or half wave being 160 feet approx. Although the AMPRO are electrically resonant they are severely compromised at 2.5 meters in length.

I guess its just working out how to make the best possible 80 meter home antenna within the compromises, some experimentation will be needed.